http://www.whitneyzone.com/wz/ubbthreads.php RSS Feed - WhitneyZone General Discussion WhitneyZone Message Board - UBB.threads(tm) http://www.whitneyzone.com/wz/ubbthreads.php/topics/31402/Re_Resuming_Search#Post31402 Posted by SierraNevada:
[quote=Maverick] SEKI NPS & Inyo NF has given us the waiver and are allowing us to conduct our search! Thanks for your help! [/quote] Good work, Mav. It's nice to reaffirm that common sense can still prevail over bureaucratic BS, with sustained leadership effort and public support. People are so divided and so afraid to act on so many issues these days, it's great to see a win. Godspeed. I hope to join in the search.]]> Fri, 17 May 2013 19:27:49 PDT http://www.whitneyzone.com/wz/ubbthreads.php/topics/31401/Re_Grand_Canyon_Rim_to_Rim_Car#Post31401 Posted by Steve C:
Made it home at 4 PM Friday. Drove 4 hours last night, and 8 today. Two days driving and one day hiking... No wonder I don't do that very often. In fact, it was 39 years ago that I last hiked to the Colorado and back! Some of the memorable part is all the various people I met on the trail. The R-2-R is a destination for trail (ultra)runners and marathoners. A group of 5 or 6 runners passed me in the morning, and of course I never saw them again. While having my first ever morning beer at the Phantom Ranch Canteen, two women in their upper 20s, and a mom (mother-daughter marathon team) showed up. Mom was ready to head back to south rim, but the two gals were heading to the N Rim to spend the night, ....and do a return R-2-R today! Of course I never saw them again either. By the way, heading up the north side, I puzzled at my headache. Then it dawned on me: a morning beer doesn't sit well with hiking. Ibuprofen and several hours later, I was fine. As the third hike in two weeks, I again met several Germans. They travel the world to hike! I met Julius and his family in the perfect spot to exchange keys: Ribbon Falls. I spent a longer time on the trail than the others for several reasons: taking pictures, drinking beer, talking with hikers, chilling at Ribbon Falls. But it all added to the enjoyment. I was one of the first hikers to start in the morning, but I am sure I was the last to finish. But then all the others were repeaters, so were doing it just to get it done. This was probably my first and only time. Another thought: It is remarkable how many women are on the trail. Groups of only women, mixed groups. Impressed that several were obviously the group's leader, in charge of seeing that all was well with their group. Good to see. And one more: Met quite a few backpackers coming down from the N. Rim. So many carrying huge packs! With such warm dry weather, seems like going tentless, and with maybe a one-pound bag would sure make their climb out easier. The sites at Cottonwood campground were without shade. Whew, not pretty!]]> Fri, 17 May 2013 18:28:13 PDT http://www.whitneyzone.com/wz/ubbthreads.php/topics/31392/Re_The_Highest_Brawl_In_World_#Post31392 Posted by Sierra Angler:
World Class Alpine Climbers are a Ego Driven Lot , this is a Given. We have Had Many on Trips in the Past and Many Cannot Stand Waiting of Any Kind. They are always being held Up it seems , by weather or Other Inferior humans. This is a given as they are the Race horses of our Species. This coupled with the New Sherpa generation ( much different than the Old Generation that Hillary Knew) that Whole Villages Mind set , STATUS,and Financial Support is centered around Being a High Altitude Sherpa ... Their Version of a Highly Respected Position in their Society.... ie... " A Rock Star" . The " Constant Negotiations for Pay" is a favorite Past time for the Sherpas and they have Played it to the Hilt Every Time on Every Expedition for Decades Now. Many Expeditions not Either Knowing this or Not Planning for this Have Incurred Major EXTRA COSTS, DELAYS ,Disruptions, and Ultimate Shutting Down of the Whole Expedition and Even to the Point of them " Leaving Everything Brought up the Mountain From to Base Camp and on the Upper mountain.... Behind " , as the Sherpas simply Left. The new generation is Very sensitive about their Elevated Status as a High Altitude Sherpa and Not simply a Load Porter . They Expect to Be Totally Laid Out in Tech Gear and the Latest Apparel and Boots etc as well as Monetary rewards. Barter , Patience, disappointment, Cultural and Language differences Make" give and take the game"... sometimes every Morning... ask Chris Bonington. The Entire Group Can Strike at a Moments notice. The Big Mountains Have rock and ice fall Happening All the Time and add climbers above You and there you go. They boys Probably - Simply got Antsy Waiting and Without Loads and Using All the Already Fixed Ropes ... they were Super Men Speed Climbing Past the Hard working Fixed ropes Crew that had Been Hard at it for Hours that day. " Let Us Finish Our Job and you can use the Ropes to Be Rock Stars After" was not Part of the Mind Set. Classic " One EYEBROW " mentality Meets Labor Crew. Add High Altitude,Egos, Oxygen Deprivation, Headaches,Frozen Hands feet, gear , Biggest and Baddest Mountain Climbing Conditions on the Planet and Howling Ice , Snow and Freezing Gear.....It Happens Every Expedition Trip On Tiny and Massive scales Every Year. Perhaps that is why Messener and others went for the Scaled down Versions. It will Get Worse in the Future for sure . At least it was all defused by "the Lady " , thank God. Any way, the moral is Chose Wisely in All things and those Around You , or Else. Cheers Sierra Angler]]> Thu, 16 May 2013 13:04:03 PDT http://www.whitneyzone.com/wz/ubbthreads.php/topics/31387/Re_Current_Conditions_Mt_Whitn#Post31387 Posted by ericephoto:
Looks like it snowed up high last night. ]]> Wed, 15 May 2013 17:00:25 PDT http://www.whitneyzone.com/wz/ubbthreads.php/topics/31385/Re_JMT_Section_Closed#Post31385 Posted by Sierra Angler:
Yep, super Steves Cape and new Outfit add Style to his enhanced Ability's in the Backcountry !! Sierra Angler]]> Wed, 15 May 2013 07:09:36 PDT http://www.whitneyzone.com/wz/ubbthreads.php/topics/31383/Re_Bees_kill_climber#Post31383 Posted by sssss:
bees can be an issue in Arizona... [url=http://blogs.phoenixnewtimes.com/valleyfever/2012/10/camelback_mountain_hiker_dies.php]AZ bee stories[/url] ]]> Tue, 14 May 2013 23:09:04 PDT http://www.whitneyzone.com/wz/ubbthreads.php/topics/31382/Re_LADWP_loses_lawsuit_over_Ow#Post31382 Posted by kurt765:
Every time I see the Owens Lake bed, it intrigues me that there used to be such a big lake there until LA drank it. It seems from what I read no one really cared about keeping it a lake, but then of course the dry lake bed became a huge problem and I'm glad they are fixing it. I try to imagine a steamboat hauling mined materials across it to Cartego, and I also try to imagine the photos I could take with such a lake reflecting the magnificent Sierras behind them.]]> Tue, 14 May 2013 23:07:41 PDT http://www.whitneyzone.com/wz/ubbthreads.php/topics/31377/Re_The_Muir_Project#Post31377 Posted by Kandy:
We bought our tickets last night! Cannot wait!]]> Tue, 14 May 2013 07:59:11 PDT http://www.whitneyzone.com/wz/ubbthreads.php/topics/31367/Re_Injured_Hiker_Extricated_Fr#Post31367 Posted by Bob West:
You're correct, George. Once a police (local PD, Sheriff, CHP) incident report has been done, most of the information contained therein is public, with certain exceptions, such as names of minor persons. The California law also applies to incidents within the national parks. It is not unusual to see names of victim(s) and the reporting party in news media reports of SAR operations. However, I believe it is the responsibility of law enforcement officials to release that information when asked. I recall, while on Inyo SAR, that we would often be approached by local media reporters, fishing for information. It was our policy to direct them to the Inyo Sheriff representative, and not offer them "insider" information. Here is the straight scoop on the California law: http://www.lapdonline.org/i_want_to_know/content_basic_view/36329]]> Mon, 13 May 2013 10:45:50 PDT http://www.whitneyzone.com/wz/ubbthreads.php/topics/31366/Re_Overnight_permit_question#Post31366 Posted by Kali:
Wow, I'm surprised by the number of unused permits! Thanks for the link.]]> Mon, 13 May 2013 09:38:58 PDT http://www.whitneyzone.com/wz/ubbthreads.php/topics/31363/Re_Larry_Conn_Missing_Flyer_an#Post31363 Posted by Steve C:
Both came up last night, and again now. ...on Firefox. I agree that a PDF would be a good format for a printable flyer.]]> Mon, 13 May 2013 08:46:47 PDT http://www.whitneyzone.com/wz/ubbthreads.php/topics/31353/Re_Cottonwood_Pass_Big_Whitney#Post31353 Posted by Steve C:
So.BayMark's [url=http://www.whitneyzone.com/wz/ubbthreads.php/topics/31343]New Army Pass 5-11-13[/url] trip report, and the pictures in his link, should give you a good idea of what you might encounter.]]> Mon, 13 May 2013 00:45:37 PDT http://www.whitneyzone.com/wz/ubbthreads.php/topics/31308/Re_Better_Snowpack_Measurement#Post31308 Posted by Harvey Lankford:
Even without a Twin Otter and lidar, it was visually obvious in April when I was there that this was the lowest snowpack year I had ever seen in 25 trips. Wonder what the resident observers say? ]]> Thu, 09 May 2013 09:46:52 PDT http://www.whitneyzone.com/wz/ubbthreads.php/topics/31288/Re_Whitney_Portal_Hostel_Roomm#Post31288 Posted by SierraNevada:
I had a hostile roommate back in college, had to kick him out. I hope your hostile roommate turns out better. Good luck and enjoy your hike. ;) ]]> Wed, 08 May 2013 10:45:10 PDT http://www.whitneyzone.com/wz/ubbthreads.php/topics/31275/Re_Yosemite_Rangers_Search_For#Post31275 Posted by Bee:
No, no -- Harvey, I was not thinking or responding to your post (if I "replied" to you, it was for convenience of beeing the next poster) I was just sort of bracing myself for the usual insensitive comments that follow reports/accidents such as these. (other boards/posters are familiar with my wrath towards these types) My apologies for not clarifying the post.]]> Tue, 07 May 2013 16:29:38 PDT http://www.whitneyzone.com/wz/ubbthreads.php/topics/31247/Re_Glacier_Point_Road_in_Yosem#Post31247 Posted by Steve C:
I did the Panorama Loop yesterday, so yes, it is completely open. With the little snow, I am sure Clouds Rest is accessible from the Valley, and will be from the Tioga road as soon as they open the road.]]> Mon, 06 May 2013 12:03:15 PDT http://www.whitneyzone.com/wz/ubbthreads.php/topics/31244/Re_Spot_Me_questions#Post31244 Posted by Steve C:
That's a funny story, Bee. If there had been a findmespot page set up, you could have viewed its location online. Would have been fun to see where it was calling from. I'm making another run to Yosemite on Friday, so will pay attention to blinking red lights to see where and when it does that.]]> Mon, 06 May 2013 09:27:13 PDT http://www.whitneyzone.com/wz/ubbthreads.php/topics/31239/Re_Hantavirus_in_Yosemite#Post31239 Posted by wagga:
Woman sues Delaware North according to [url=http://abclocal.go.com/kabc/story?section=news/state&id=9091194]KABC-TV[/url]. I've visited all the Channel Islands and also Havasupai, and they do specifically warn about the potential hazard. Delaware North did not provide warnings, and also built structures that the HantaMice really liked. ]]> Sun, 05 May 2013 20:33:40 PDT http://www.whitneyzone.com/wz/ubbthreads.php/topics/31235/Re_Portal_Road_amp_Horseshoe_M#Post31235 Posted by John Sims:
[quote=marmoting]The trail to Cottonwood Lakes was clear and dry today. Army Pass is still covered in steep snow, but there are snow-free alternatives. The snow on New Army Pass can be bypassed via rocks to the west. The chute north of the Fin is completely dry. Army Point and Cirque can also be climbed without snow. Even Langley can be climbed without touching snow. [/quote] Thanks for the update. Guess I'll wait a while.]]> Sun, 05 May 2013 10:35:00 PDT http://www.whitneyzone.com/wz/ubbthreads.php/topics/31234/Re_Missing_Hikers_In_Cleveland#Post31234 Posted by wbtravis:
Bee, Almost half my outdoors time is in the snow. My friends and I save people most winters from themselves, saving the taxpayers thousands of dollars. Last winter, there was a woman up on Baden-Powell summit ridge in white out blizzard conditions by herself, prepared for a summer day hike only colder, whereas my friends and I were hauling around about 30# of this and that. We got her down off the mountain but not without her freaking out once because a slick traverse. She told us she would have never have made it off the mountain without our aid. I would like to say this is the only time this has happened but it seems to happen at least once a winter. Mostly from people following us to some way off the grid spot where they can't descend safely or are hopelessly lost without neither map nor compass. I believe, if SAR was called out on this there should have been some type of penalty.]]> Sun, 05 May 2013 07:22:13 PDT http://www.whitneyzone.com/wz/ubbthreads.php/topics/31230/Re_What_are_your_plans_this_ye#Post31230 Posted by ShellyB:
I'm trying to do a trip every other weekend until my August Whitney trip. So far I have Mt. Baldy, Mt. San Jacinto, Mt. San Gorgonio, North Fork to the Pallisades, Desolation Lake, White Mtn. After Whitney I don't know what I'll do, maybe the Lost Coast Trail.]]> Sat, 04 May 2013 19:51:09 PDT http://www.whitneyzone.com/wz/ubbthreads.php/topics/31220/Re_Oklahoma_Teen_Inspired_By_I#Post31220 Posted by SierraNevada:
[quote=wagga][url=http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/There_ain%27t_no_such_thing_as_a_free_lunch]TANSTAAFL![/url] [/quote] Serendipitously, I had a cold Japanese Thai Jamaican fusion salad this afternoon, two for one with a coupon.]]> Fri, 03 May 2013 22:02:32 PDT http://www.whitneyzone.com/wz/ubbthreads.php/topics/31207/Re_New_Interior_Secretary_Is_O#Post31207 Posted by CaliHawk:
[quote=wagga]One of the comments on that link is insightful: "[i] I fail to see how one who is not of our many people, doesn't live or has lived on a reservation can possibly have our best interests at heart, but I'm willing to give this woman a chance & see how she handles herself with our interests. Sometimes there is that rare white person who is a friend to us & truly has our spirit. Rare as such a one is, they are out here none the less.[/i]" [/quote] Does the word insightful now mean shallow and racist? Yeah, I understand history, but I truly hope that that attitude is not more widespread. I say that because she seems to be a pretty good choice. I'm moderate in my political views but have a concern with many that the President has surrounded himself with, especially the Attorney General. But this appears to be a pretty good choice; measured and reasonable and loves nature.]]> Fri, 03 May 2013 09:25:54 PDT http://www.whitneyzone.com/wz/ubbthreads.php/topics/31177/Re_Whitney_Overnight_6_30_Weat#Post31177 Posted by wbtravis:
The skeeters will be around. I've been bitten at Whitney Portal in May. I'd bring my 100% DEET.]]> Wed, 01 May 2013 20:46:20 PDT http://www.whitneyzone.com/wz/ubbthreads.php/topics/31159/Re_Mt_Whitney_late_spring#Post31159 Posted by wbtravis:
SN, We all do stupid things. The questions are when and where. I did something incredible stupid this past winter but it was in a place where the most that could happen to were ripped this and that and; scrapes and bruises...and that what I ended up with. If I did what did in the chute in April or May of this year, I would not be posting this. As you noted, people die and get hurt in the chute from time to time. Usually, from not knowing what they are getting into after a long arduous day on Mt. Whitney when the mind is not function on all 8 cylinders.]]> Wed, 01 May 2013 08:09:31 PDT http://www.whitneyzone.com/wz/ubbthreads.php/topics/31130/Re_Altitude_Sickness_Question#Post31130 Posted by Brent N:
Everyone, thank you for the useful tips. I really appreciate it. Brent]]> Tue, 30 Apr 2013 09:00:16 PDT http://www.whitneyzone.com/wz/ubbthreads.php/topics/31128/Re_Plane_Missing_Over_Yosemite#Post31128 Posted by wagga:
An [url=http://calcoastnews.com/2013/04/missing-pilot-search-still-delayed/]update[/url]. "[i]A search for a missing Solvang pilot whose single-engine airplane apparently crashed near Yosemite National Park’s Half Dome will be resumed in June, park officials said.[/i]" ]]> Tue, 30 Apr 2013 04:51:16 PDT http://www.whitneyzone.com/wz/ubbthreads.php/topics/31097/Re_west_chute_question#Post31097 Posted by John Sims:
[quote=Steve C]Great answer John! :thanks: [/quote] You are welcome! You taught me well:-)]]> Sat, 27 Apr 2013 14:20:36 PDT http://www.whitneyzone.com/wz/ubbthreads.php/topics/31095/Re_Current_snow_level#Post31095 Posted by nyker:
Ok, thanks Fishmonger.]]> Sat, 27 Apr 2013 06:03:25 PDT http://www.whitneyzone.com/wz/ubbthreads.php/topics/31083/Re_Tioga_Pass_to_open_May_11#Post31083 Posted by George:
And Sonora Pass opened yesterday.]]> Thu, 25 Apr 2013 19:51:22 PDT http://www.whitneyzone.com/wz/ubbthreads.php/topics/31068/Re_Mountaineers_Route_Apr_28_2#Post31068 Posted by Dave Alden:
Ya pretty big group, my friend went a little crazy with the invites. We'll more than likely spend Sat and Sun night at Iceberg Lake.]]> Wed, 24 Apr 2013 16:16:33 PDT http://www.whitneyzone.com/wz/ubbthreads.php/topics/31063/Re_Yosemite_prescribed_burn#Post31063 Posted by George:
Notice how open those trees are spaced. Until prescribed fire was started by NPS in the late 60s in both Yosemite and Sequoia Kings, these forested areas were often impenetrable thickets of young white fir and other pines, a result of over 100 years of fire suppression. In addition, there was little successful Giant Sequoia reproduction in the Sequoia Groves. Early explorers had written of being able to ride their horses through these areas which was not possible after decades of fire suppression. I was lucky enough to have as my college adviser Harold Biswell (aka Harold the Torch) who was one of the early advocates and researchers in fire ecology. This photo is a terrific example of the success of those efforts. Thanks for the post. g.]]> Wed, 24 Apr 2013 12:43:16 PDT http://www.whitneyzone.com/wz/ubbthreads.php/topics/31060/Re_FUN_NEW_GAME#Post31060 Posted by DUG:
[quote=2600fromatari][quote=saltydog]Also interesting note by Steve: Since I joined just over two years ago, WHA membership has gone from under 400 to over 1000. Intetesting that readership has gone down in the same period.[/quote] You'll notice that most people join only to ask a question and never come back. Some are thoughtful, but most are, "do I need crampons"..."is the trail clear of snow"...People ask, but never even follow up and post their own TR or a conditions report for the benefit of other hikers or climbers. [quote=DUG]Langley is on our list for this summer.[/quote] Just Langley or Langley/Whitney? I'd be interested in joining you for a long day of Langley>Whitney and arrange some sort of shuttle if you're ever looking for another person to share in the pain (work permitting of course). :) [/quote] We are planning to go from Onion Valley towards Cottonwood with side trips to Whitney and Langley. Since it is for a scout patch (not merit badge) it has to be at least 5 days...................................DUG]]> Wed, 24 Apr 2013 06:57:06 PDT http://www.whitneyzone.com/wz/ubbthreads.php/topics/31019/Re_Yosemite_Park_expansion#Post31019 Posted by Steve C:
There is a section of 1600 acres of private property that two groups own that some are trying to add to the Yosemite National Park area. I believe the area is near the Yosemite West area, west of Hwy 41 near the Glacier Point junction (but I am not sure). Here is an LA Times article: [url=http://www.latimes.com/news/local/political/la-me-pc-yosemite-expansion-20130419,0,7494157.story]California lawmakers call for expansion of Yosemite National Park[/url] [quote]SACRAMENTO -- State lawmakers are supporting a proposal to expand Yosemite National Park by 1,600 acres, restoring land stripped of its protection by Congress in 1906. The state Senate approved a resolution this week that asks the federal government to approve the expansion.[/quote] The state senator for the area is mentioned in this article: [url=http://www.oakdaleleader.com/section/44/article/10554/]Berryhill Resolution Advocates Expanding Yosemite Boundaries[/url] And then from the other side: U.S. Rep. Tom McClintock is opposing the acquisition: [url=http://www.sacbee.com/2013/04/14/5338269/editorial-mcclintock-hardly-matches.html]Sacramento Bee editorial[/url] Congressman McClintock's own view: [url=http://goldrushcam.com/sierrasuntimes/index.php/news/mariposa-daily-news-2013/145-april/8148-congressman-tom-mcclintock-protecting-the-publics-right-to-enjoy-yosemite-response-to-a-sacramento-bee-editorial-]Protecting the Public's Right to Enjoy Yosemite[/url] Pacific Forest Trust site: [url=https://pacificforest.org/Yosemite-Anniversary-BLA.html]Expand Yosemite Park by 1,600 Acres[/url] (shows a map of the area) Certainly some interesting points made in the debate.]]> Sat, 20 Apr 2013 23:59:56 PDT http://www.whitneyzone.com/wz/ubbthreads.php/topics/31010/Re_Whitney_Portal_Store_is_now#Post31010 Posted by Steve C:
Fishmonger reported the store is open as of Friday, April 19. Here's to another good season! Wishing Doug and his crew all the best.]]> Sat, 20 Apr 2013 09:33:21 PDT http://www.whitneyzone.com/wz/ubbthreads.php/topics/31009/Re_Bighorn_herd_reintroduced#Post31009 Posted by Bob West:
Here is the official Big Horn Sheep project website: http://sierrabighorn.org/natural-history/ Yes, the numbers have been declining in recent years, because of several factors. See the website for more information. They are very, VERY, difficult to spot, and can appear as little white dots against the mountain terrain. High powered binoculars or spotting scopes are required for a good view. A couple of years ago, we saw a group of 12 (twelve!) rams standing together in the Wheeler Ridge area just below a popular climbing area. When I was working at Pine Creek Mine, we would sometimes see rams fighting on the mine road, within a hundred yards of the tungsten mill! They were totally intent on the fight, regardless of the nearby humans. One of the best viewing sites is at the Pine Creek pack station, looking up to the North above the mine road. In the winter, they sometimes gather on that slope to feed. Last Fall, my wife and I saw three rams and 10 ewes almost on the paved road below the tungsten mill. If you go there to see them, do not approach them; it will spook them away from their feeding. Today, in Bishop, there will be a guided tour of one of the Big Horn Sheep habitats, with a chance to view the sheep from a distance through scopes. This tour is usually conducted annually - see the website for information. The project can use whatever financial support you can give. ]]> Sat, 20 Apr 2013 09:04:48 PDT http://www.whitneyzone.com/wz/ubbthreads.php/topics/31006/Re_High_Sierra_Trail_in_August#Post31006 Posted by saltydog:
Congratulations! If you haven't logged on to High SIerra Topix yet, you should start doing that over the next few weeks. Chances are, you'll develop some acquaintances who will be in the area about the same time. You will be able to get a feel for who might be willing to make contact on the trail. I met two such parties there in 2011, proving very enjoyable and useful in trading info and general support. As Steve said, you will not be alone on this trail, unless you make an effort to go cross country. Making some informal contacts rather than a firm commitment to join a group will give you the opportunity to enjoy some solitude and still have the comfort of some kind of support group. I wold also bet that by the time you are two days in, you will be looking for less company, rather than more. Second bit of advice: pace yourself to avoid camping at Bearpaw. Its a convenient first day distance from the TH, but by far the most boring spot on the whole trail: overused, dusty, water issues (faucets, no less, with warnings to treat anyway) in deep wood, no views, downhill from the trail etc., its not even a nice rest stop. ]]> Sat, 20 Apr 2013 04:41:03 PDT http://www.whitneyzone.com/wz/ubbthreads.php/topics/30988/Re_Solar_Toilets_vs_Carrying_W#Post30988 Posted by SierraNevada:
Sorry, George, was not trying to be snarky. I find it ironic that SEKI NP has this nice looking toilet at Pear Lake within a designated wilderness that happens to be due west of Mt Whitney. Has an engineer looked at the composting issues there or is this left to Rangers to figure out? This elevation is probably about as high as you want to go with a composter type, a dehydrator starts to be a better choice. In order for a composting toilet to work here, the building must be very well insulated and solar heated as much as possible. It looks like it's had a makeover in the photo, I wonder if they insulated the inside of those pretty stone masonry walls. I didn't realize Bearpaw was in an enclave boundary excluded from designated wilderness, but it's been there for 75 yrs so it makes sense. Muir Trail Ranch is like that, right on the JMT, also with toilets of course. Same with the Yosemite High Sierra Camps. Here's the quote from the Bearpaw website, "Bearpaw is set 11.5 miles into pristine national park backcountry, high atop a 7,800-foot granite saddle overlooking the Great Western Divide. Central shower house with flush toilets and hot showers." Nice little business in the middle of a wilderness. I think we just have to agree to disagree about this one, George. You're a Ranger recommending hiring more Rangers to pick up plastic bags, and I'm an engineer recommending toilets as the best solution for a popular area like the Whitney Zone. I look at that toilet in the photo and I don't see impacts, I see proven environmental protection that's perfect for a lot of people in a sensitive area. The costs are shared by many and it comes out similar to the plastic bags full of chemicals. We both understand the difficulty of reversing what has been done at Whitney, but I thought you could at least stop claiming they don't work. I hope you can acknowledge that toilets are not unusual in the backcountry, whether it's designated wilderness or a carved out enclave surrounded by designated wilderness.]]> Thu, 18 Apr 2013 22:01:23 PDT http://www.whitneyzone.com/wz/ubbthreads.php/topics/30957/Re_Another_permit_question#Post30957 Posted by Mescalito345:
Steve: thanks for the information. I called Recreation.gov today, and it seems like there is now another possibility. The group leader can call the permit office a few days before the hike date, and tell them that someone else in their group is going to pick up the permit. I asked them if the group leader could do that right now, but the answer was no. It has something to do with scalpers buying up permits, and then selling them for a higher price.]]> Mon, 15 Apr 2013 19:57:52 PDT http://www.whitneyzone.com/wz/ubbthreads.php/topics/30939/Re_Woman_Dead_Man_Missing_in_W#Post30939 Posted by Bee:
[size:14pt][b]Woman Dead, Man Missing in Wash. Avalanches[/b][/size] [i] A woman hiker has died and another hiker is missing after a pair of avalanches occurred in the Cascade Mountains in Washington state this weekend, authorities said. [/i] More [url=http://gma.yahoo.com/woman-dead-man-missing-wash-avalanches-175614856--abc-news-topstories.html]Here[/url] ]]> Sun, 14 Apr 2013 19:14:30 PDT