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Re: Whitney Lottery 2014
63ChevyII.com #35411 03/24/14 12:04 PM
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We got one this year. Overnight permit beginning September 17.

Good luck everyone.

Re: Whitney Lottery 2014
Steve C #35412 03/24/14 12:04 PM
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Originally Posted By: Steve C
From the looks of it, I think Recreation.gov has some 'splainin' to do. frown

And PLEASE do not call and yell at the Inyo people. They are just "users" of the recreation.gov site. Some software people in another part of the country are the ones running rec.gov.


I need to revise that. Inyo staff tells me that they are already seeing lots of cancellations going on online.

So apparently there are lots of people who got slots they cannot use.

Re: Whitney Lottery 2014
Steve C #35413 03/24/14 12:29 PM
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After a long wait on Rec.gov, I talked to a woman who said the earliest you can pay for your permit is April 1st, 8:00 A.M. Hope that helps.


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Re: Whitney Lottery 2014
Steve C #35414 03/24/14 12:38 PM
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Originally Posted By: Steve C
I don't think that is quite right. During the lottery processing, your applications get processed in a random order. So the one you "won" got processed first.

Then, the process goes down through your requested dates, processing those on THAT one application in order, first to last. As soon as one is successful, the system looks up all your other applications and cancels (or Revokes???) them. I was not aware that it would look you up in the Alternate Leader slots, and cancel those, too.


Your scenario sounds more likely.

She also made it sound like a person reviews all of the winning applications and determines if more than one app is part of the same group or trip to decide if one needs to be revoked.

Re: Whitney Lottery 2014
63ChevyII.com #35415 03/24/14 12:55 PM
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I believe my permit was issued for my 1st date on Aug 27th. I hit confirm and then submit.

It responded with



"This permit reservation cannot be processed. Please try again later."

Guess the computers must be real busy.

Re: Whitney Lottery 2014
Sparty85 #35416 03/24/14 01:07 PM
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Anyone know if changing your group number after your permit is awarded changes anything with the permit being accepted?


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Re: Whitney Lottery 2014
Steve C #35417 03/24/14 01:20 PM
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Recreation.gov call center told me that my lottery application just wasn't one of the ones chosen ("we only pick some of them").

Inyo told me that they've had a ton of cancellations, and those show up on Recreation.gov right away. But the # of available permits on Recreation.gov for the dates I'm looking at don't seem to have changed over the past few hours, so I'm questioning that.

I think the most likely scenario is that Recreation.gov:
1. Ran the full lottery.
2. Processed all the cancellations for duplicate trips, same leader on multiple trips, etc.
3. Didn't go back to re-run still valid, yet originally unsuccessful, lottery applications to fill the remaining spaces.

Whitney Lottery 2014
David B #35419 03/24/14 01:38 PM
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It appears we were successful on our permit request for July 29th (group of 8). When my daughter went on-line to accept and pay, it said currently unavailable. Hopefully, everything will get straightened out in the next couple of days.

Re: Whitney Lottery 2014
David B #35420 03/24/14 01:42 PM
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Originally Posted By: David B

I think the most likely scenario is that Recreation.gov:
1. Ran the full lottery.
2. Processed all the cancellations for duplicate trips, same leader on multiple trips, etc.
3. Didn't go back to re-run still valid, yet originally unsuccessful, lottery applications to fill the remaining spaces.


That's exactly what I think happened David.

Re: Whitney Lottery 2014
63ChevyII.com #35421 03/24/14 02:20 PM
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Got my first choice! Monday August 4th over-nighter. Thanks for all the help on here Steve!






“Any thoughts of guilt, any feelings of regret, had faded. The desert had baked them out.” - Stephen King


Re: Whitney Lottery 2014
Steve C #35423 03/24/14 03:17 PM
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Originally Posted By: Steve C

I don't think that is quite right. During the lottery processing, your applications get processed in a random order. So the one you "won" got processed first.

Then, the process goes down through your requested dates, processing those on THAT one application in order, first to last. As soon as one is successful, the system looks up all your other applications and cancels (or Revokes???) them. I was not aware that it would look you up in the Alternate Leader slots, and cancel those, too.


After talking to a gal at the Inyo office, it appears that is exactly what happened, however , this cancellation step was not completed until after all lottery dates were filled. After the lottery was completed, the computer went back and threw out all applications that had duplicate names in the alternate leader slots. That left numerous permits available (e.g. 42 permits for August 14) for many dates in the popular months.

The strategy in our group of 5 was to individually submit one application per person as trip leader. We had different email addresses and we paid separately. We named each other as alternates. So far, three of our applications has failed. If all five fail, we won't be too happy because there are already permits available for dates we selected. We assumed that one entry per trip leader was okay, regardless of the names of alternates. We will see if that is true. If all five were thrown out because it was determined a group cannot submit more that one application we will be unhappy because it was not specified in the lottery rules that that strategy was illegal.

Re: Whitney Lottery 2014
Abhijit #35426 03/24/14 04:10 PM
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AJ,

If you still have those slots, PLEASE do not release them. My wife and I filled out 8 applications and all failed. We would be ecstatic if you let us take two of your slots, or even join you during the hike. We aren't fast, but we have done far more grueling hikes than Mt. Whitney (the Pemi Loop in the White Mountains comes to mind) and we've hiked above 12000 feet numerous times.

Thanks!
Brian

Re: Whitney Lottery 2014
Sparty85 #35427 03/24/14 04:14 PM
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I wonder how nuts registration is going to be on April 1st?

Is it 8am EST that the permits are released? Or PST?

Re: Whitney Lottery 2014
oldhiker #35428 03/24/14 04:31 PM
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Alright, a follow-up on my above post. It turns out that only 4 of the 5 in our group entered the lottery. All 4 applications were "unsuccessful". It is possible that none of our applications were selected prior to the end of the lottery award process. Here is what is really irritating: the computer is set up to throw out duplicate group applications after the lottery is complete. That leaves numerous permits available that I should have had a shot at winning. The lottery should have continued until all 200, or whatever number, permits were awarded for each day. This lottery is run stupidly, my opinion only.

Re: Whitney Lottery 2014
oldhiker #35432 03/24/14 06:48 PM
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Does anyone know if the current results being displayed are permanent? Some of the people from my group that I listed as alternate leaders put in separate applications for different dates for themselves to go in smaller groups in case our group of 5 did not get picked. I was awarded the permit, but I'm afraid that the computer/rec.gov people might still be going through and cancelling duplicate applications. I am super worried that I will check back tomorrow and my permit will be revoked.

Re: Whitney Lottery 2014
JulieB #35433 03/24/14 09:58 PM
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Julie, I am sure they will not be "un-awarding" permit reservations.

We have not heard this business about alternates being taken out in prior years lotteries, and I am sure we can get more information as time goes on.

Expeditiondan: My first intuition is that it will be 7 AM PDT, but not sure.

Re: Whitney Lottery 2014
Steve C #35437 03/25/14 12:16 AM
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Yeah, the whole thing is very weird. My day hike permit was unsuccessful. Not revoked, just straight up unsuccessful. Yet my application alternatives blanketed 15 nearly-consecutive days in late August and early September. My application was for a party of six. It looks like for 11 out of the 15 days I listed as options on my application (including my first choice, Tuesday 8/19), there are at least 6 open slots. What gives?

Am I reading the availability wrong? The X and a number shows the number of open spots, right?

Guess I won't be sleeping in on April 1st...

Re: Whitney Lottery 2014
aitkenb1z #35439 03/25/14 06:45 AM
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Brian,
I sent you a PM as well. I don't have any problem for keeping the slots.

AJ

Re: Whitney Lottery 2014
Steve C #35441 03/25/14 08:19 AM
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I was unsuccessful in the lottery for an overnight midweek in August. But I was successful for a dayhike in July. I'm thinking I didn't get the overnight even though I used my wife's name - the leader and alternates were the same for 3 apps I submitted. I wish I had known this would disqualify 2 of my 3 apps. When I check current availability I see an "x" and a number. Is this number the number of available spots? And how do I score these spots? Do I wait till April 1?

Re: Whitney Lottery 2014
Abhijit #35442 03/25/14 08:22 AM
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After we applied rec.gov appears to have changed (or made up)the rules regarding alternate leaders names. They still have not corrected the problem with entered data vanishing before the form is completed. This rec.gov site had a sloppy roll-out last year and continues to be disappointing.

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