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#40232 - 09/12/14 02:08 PM Mt. Langley or White Mt Peak, Oct 4&5
63ChevyII.com Offline


Registered: 08/07/12
Posts: 670
Loc: Colton, California
My father-in-law will be visiting in a few weeks. The last time he was here we hiked Whitney. I would like to plan a quick overnighter while he's here.

I am thinking about taking a shot at Langley (overnight at CWL #3, up NAP and down OAP). If the weather doesn't cooperate (rain/snow) we may try White Mtn Peak instead.

Looking at the weather data for Oct '13, it's a bit milder than what I was expecting. Is this 'normal?'

It seems that if we carried the same gear we used in early June for our Whitney hike, it should be sufficient.

Thoughts?
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#40233 - 09/12/14 03:47 PM Re: Mt. Langley or White Mt Peak, Oct 4&5 [Re: 63ChevyII.com]
Harvey Lankford Offline


Registered: 11/10/09
Posts: 985
Loc: Richmond, Virginia
just an option:

Dan and I just did Langley last month. We got to Long Lake so early in the day, we just guzzled water there, filled up 3 quarts ( 1 for dinner, 2 breakfast/lunch next day) and spent the night at top of NAP. (We had spent 3 nights at Mammoth before, so had a little acclimatization). There are semi-sheltered camp areas at NAP. This gave us a tremendous headstart for Langley summit day. We kept going north after that into Miter Basin, but you would be returning south. A few pictures on my TR:

Miter Basin TR


Edited by Harvey Lankford (09/12/14 03:49 PM)

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#40235 - 09/12/14 04:14 PM Re: Mt. Langley or White Mt Peak, Oct 4&5 [Re: 63ChevyII.com]
Steve C Offline


Registered: 09/22/09
Posts: 7228
Loc: Fresno, CA
Last year was a bad drought year. We are hoping like everything that this year doesn't repeat. If no storms come, then you could go anytime in October. But I am hoping for storms.

The White Mountain road gate (near Schulman Grove) is closed sometime in the fall, so you should call the ranger station in Bishop to find out for sure.

Also remember, you have a lot (~3 hours) less daylight. Here's an extract from this post:

MT WHITNEY

Rise and Set for the Sun for 2014

Location: W118 18, N36 35
Zone: 7h West of Greenwich
(Pacific Daylight Savings Time)

June Sept. Oct.
Day Rise Set Rise Set Rise Set
h m h m h m h m h m h m
01 0536 2006 0625 1921 0649 1837
02 0536 2007 0625 1920 0649 1835
03 0536 2007 0626 1918 0650 1834
04 0535 2008 0627 1917 0651 1832
05 0535 2009 0628 1915 0652 1831
06 0535 2009 0628 1914 0653 1829
07 0535 2010 0629 1912 0654 1828
08 0535 2010 0630 1911 0654 1826
09 0534 2011 0631 1909 0655 1825
10 0534 2011 0632 1908 0656 1824
11 0534 2012 0632 1906 0657 1822
12 0534 2012 0633 1905 0658 1821
13 0534 2012 0634 1903 0659 1819
14 0534 2013 0635 1902 0700 1818
15 0534 2013 0636 1900 0701 1817
16 0534 2014 0636 1859 0702 1815
17 0534 2014 0637 1857 0702 1814
18 0535 2014 0638 1856 0703 1813
19 0535 2014 0639 1854 0704 1811
20 0535 2015 0640 1853 0705 1810
21 0535 2015 0640 1851 0706 1809
22 0535 2015 0641 1850 0707 1808
23 0536 2015 0642 1848 0708 1807
24 0536 2015 0643 1847 0709 1805
25 0536 2015 0644 1845 0710 1804
26 0537 2016 0644 1844 0711 1803
27 0537 2016 0645 1842 0712 1802
28 0537 2016 0646 1841 0713 1801
29 0538 2016 0647 1839 0714 1800
30 0538 2016 0648 1838 0715 1758
31 0716 1757

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#40243 - 09/13/14 07:04 AM Re: Mt. Langley or White Mt Peak, Oct 4&5 [Re: 63ChevyII.com]
63ChevyII.com Offline


Registered: 08/07/12
Posts: 670
Loc: Colton, California
Thanks for the input! If we hike Langley, I am hoping to be on the summit for sunrise, so both of these posts are very helpful.

Since I've never hiked Langley, I'm not really sure how much time to allow for a sunrise hike though. If I were staying at Trail Camp and hiking Whitney, I would allow 4.5 hours... 4 hrs for a leisurely paced hike with a 30 minute buffer to catch some of the cool things that happen before you actually see the sun.

Based on the the info above, how much time should I allow if we camp at:
1.CWL 3?
2. Long Lake?
3. Harvey's spot at the top of NAP?
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#40245 - 09/13/14 08:50 AM Re: Mt. Langley or White Mt Peak, Oct 4&5 [Re: 63ChevyII.com]
Harvey Lankford Offline


Registered: 11/10/09
Posts: 985
Loc: Richmond, Virginia
Originally Posted By: 63ChevyII.com
Based on the the info above, how much time should I allow if we camp at:
1.CWL 3?
2. Long Lake?
3. Harvey's spot at the top of NAP?

here are our times
8/5
1003am left trailhead Cottonwood parking lot with 8 day pack
202pm tanked up with 3 qts at Long Lake. 17 min break
220pm off for the pass
500 pm NAP campsite, with packs. 12,200 ft

8/6
625 am left NAP, 32F
727 am dumped packs part way up . Approx 12,400 ft
829 am start of rockier area
1008 summit. we took a long detour zig zag first to left to short pinnacles, then along the cliff line. Only spent 5 or 10 min at top. If we had useful cairns or knew the best way, it would have been a bit faster. Coming back down we could see a straighter route.

1205 back to packs at 12,400, then headed down first chute north towards highest Soldier lake, veering off through treeline into Miter Basin

We had 8 days of supplies and too much other stuff. Your pack should be lighter and times perhaps faster.

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#40252 - 09/15/14 09:06 AM Re: Mt. Langley or White Mt Peak, Oct 4&5 [Re: 63ChevyII.com]
wbtravis Offline


Registered: 09/22/09
Posts: 1239
Loc: Corner of Jack Benny and Roche...
It really depends on how you feel at Long Lake or CL#3.

When I'm in good shape, I can make it down to Lower Rock Creek Crossing and have no problem reaching Lower Soldier Lake when in fair shape. My preference is Army Pass for Langley.

The only problems I see is having enough clothing for the cold, wind up at the pass and ability to sleep at 12,000' to 12,300'.

If you decide to stay low, there is a lot of exploring options to fill out the day.

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#40258 - 09/15/14 11:22 AM Re: Mt. Langley or White Mt Peak, Oct 4&5 [Re: 63ChevyII.com]
63ChevyII.com Offline


Registered: 08/07/12
Posts: 670
Loc: Colton, California
I really like the idea of sleeping on top of NAP, but the more I think about it, the more I think it might be too much for the group with the short trip time.

We are going up to celebrate someones birthday. Two of the people coming aren't in great hiking shape, although they are hikers (both have summitted Whitney). They are both planning on staying at camp while the rest of the group summits.

I am guessing the best idea would be for us to stay at CWL #3 and take OA pass to Langley. Based on the GPS Track I created, it looks like it is about 4 miles, 3000 ft elevation gain from CWL #3. Does that sound right? If that's the case, I'll plan on leaving camp about 6 hrs before sunrise.
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#40270 - 09/16/14 09:42 AM Re: Mt. Langley or White Mt Peak, Oct 4&5 [Re: 63ChevyII.com]
wbtravis Offline


Registered: 09/22/09
Posts: 1239
Loc: Corner of Jack Benny and Roche...
When you start to climb Langley from the top of the pass there is one trail. When you get to ~12,300' there are 30 trails. Stay as far to your left as you feel comfortable...further left the steeper it is.

When you get to the mountain, look for gaps that are ducked. These are short class 3 sections that will save you about 20 minutes each way. If you feel uncomfortable do this, just hang a left until the ducked class 2 scree slog appears.

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#40271 - 09/16/14 10:14 AM Re: Mt. Langley or White Mt Peak, Oct 4&5 [Re: wbtravis]
63ChevyII.com Offline


Registered: 08/07/12
Posts: 670
Loc: Colton, California
wbtravis,

Here is a link to the GPX file I have:
Gmap4, Cottonwood Lakes & Langley

So, I'm guessing this track goes further to the right than you recommend?

Being late in the season, am I correct in thinking that there is no need to reserve permits?

OA Pass - any issues following it in the dark? Is it all class 2?
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#40272 - 09/16/14 12:07 PM Re: Mt. Langley or White Mt Peak, Oct 4&5 [Re: 63ChevyII.com]
Harvey Lankford Offline


Registered: 11/10/09
Posts: 985
Loc: Richmond, Virginia
Chev
I cannot tell you about OAP, but as for Langley standard approach....

One person told me just do it, it is obvious. I thought that was snarky, but it was true.

Think veer left and you will be just fine.

At the beginning of the steeper bank and rocks, we ended up at one of the 8 ft tall cairns not even trying to. The single trail just leads there anyway. Sort of dead center in the picture below.

At that point we did have a quandry. It seemed like that cairn stupidly dead ended us. Going around left of the cairn was a third class move over a drop off. No go. Going up and to the right was what I did. On the way back down we realized that straight up above the cairn through an obvious but narrow slot for 10 to 20 ft was the actual route. I suppose that might be considered class 3, very short and easy coming down it. I did not go up it as it seemed awkward. Again, we avoided it. This was the ONLY area that was any issue.

After that, it does not matter. It is all wide open easy terrain, easy class 2 at the most, just sand, small rocks, and lots of use trails intertwining, or none at all. We did not aim straight for the summit unseen from there, but took an easier long zigzag to the far left toward small pinnacles on the skyline, then back around right along the cliff top to the summit. Coming back down we just came straight down to that slot I mentioned.

Sorry, I do not have a useful picture, but this one was sent to me by Karin or Tracie. The left route is what they did going up (and Dan and I went to the skyline twice as far further left), the right line is the way straight (can be used for either up or down). The important thing is to not get into the steeper terrain and cliff way, way, way over to the right. I do not see how anyone accidentally gets over there. Your eye and feet for the obvious way up on the standard approach just do not go there.
Think left. Sorry. I cannot tell where the 5 or 6 eight ft tall cairns are on the picture.

Picture and route from Karin and/or Tracie


Edit
Here is a picture of mine that might help. It was taken from NAP. The obvious trail takes you straight, then as it steepens it veers left a bit, aiming for the less steep left side of the cliff band. It is nowhere as steep as it looks, at least on the left. Again follow the obvious use trails and footprints. After the short crux of the route (the cairn and going around it that I mentioned before) we headed further left than most people do toward the small pinnacles on the left skyline, then cut right across the cliffs to the summit, then did not retrace our steps going down, but came more or less straight following lots and lots of use trails in the sand, back to that cairn. Easy stuff. Plus, at some point we could see that important cairn on the way down. If good visibility and daylight, then it is a walk in the park.









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#40278 - 09/17/14 08:00 AM Re: Mt. Langley or White Mt Peak, Oct 4&5 [Re: 63ChevyII.com]
wbtravis Offline


Registered: 09/22/09
Posts: 1239
Loc: Corner of Jack Benny and Roche...
You want to stay well to the left of the gully. As Harvey said, it pretty obvious what you need to.

That track looks well to the right of where I would go.

There are two problems you have to address...the route to the base and the where you head up. I go left and steep and through the gaps. You can right and take a longer walk around to the class 2 walk up. It is just longer.

Oh, make sure you bring a pair of scree gaiters. You will need'em.

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#40279 - 09/17/14 09:02 AM Re: Mt. Langley or White Mt Peak, Oct 4&5 [Re: wbtravis]
63ChevyII.com Offline


Registered: 08/07/12
Posts: 670
Loc: Colton, California
Thanks for the input. I'm sure I am overthinking this (as usual).

I found this GPX track. Looks like it is closer to what everyone is recommending. Since we will be ascending in the dark, I'd like to have a track that's close to where we want to be.

http://www.everytrail.com/view_trip.php?trip_id=307498

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#40283 - 09/17/14 12:54 PM Re: Mt. Langley or White Mt Peak, Oct 4&5 [Re: 63ChevyII.com]
smart1 Offline


Registered: 08/11/14
Posts: 9
Loc: Nevada
follow the cairn... that gpx track looks like the main route marked with cairn all of the way up that we followed in August. There are only 1 or 2 places where the next cairn isn't clear but if you head uphill you'll find it. There are lots of use trails and footprints that will get you there via various routes. We got multiple and varying pieces of advice from hikers coming down. We chose to follow the cairn and it worked well for us.

I don't know about White Mt. Peak but on a clear day the view from the top of Langley was spectacular!


Edited by smart1 (09/17/14 12:58 PM)

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#40289 - 09/18/14 08:49 AM Re: Mt. Langley or White Mt Peak, Oct 4&5 [Re: smart1]
wbtravis Offline


Registered: 09/22/09
Posts: 1239
Loc: Corner of Jack Benny and Roche...
Ducks are transient.

I will kick over ducks most of the time on obvious routes to maintain wilderness...and this is an obvious route.

Chevy,

You will be ok. Just make sure everyone in the group has a good light and if there is ambiguity make sure all the brains are working on how to solve it.

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#40292 - 09/18/14 12:25 PM Re: Mt. Langley or White Mt Peak, Oct 4&5 [Re: wbtravis]
smart1 Offline


Registered: 08/11/14
Posts: 9
Loc: Nevada
The cairn on Langley are not transient and I don't think you'll be kicking them over.


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#40295 - 09/18/14 02:29 PM Re: Mt. Langley or White Mt Peak, Oct 4&5 [Re: smart1]
Harvey Lankford Offline


Registered: 11/10/09
Posts: 985
Loc: Richmond, Virginia
Agreed

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#40297 - 09/18/14 07:33 PM Re: Mt. Langley or White Mt Peak, Oct 4&5 [Re: Harvey Lankford]
Akichow Offline


Registered: 04/07/10
Posts: 659
Loc: SF Bay Area
Cairns-from-Hell. Megacairns. Cairns-on-Steroids. Feh.


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#40298 - 09/18/14 07:36 PM Re: Mt. Langley or White Mt Peak, Oct 4&5 [Re: Akichow]
Akichow Offline


Registered: 04/07/10
Posts: 659
Loc: SF Bay Area
Oh, btw, the fastest way to the summit is in the background ... There's a nice easy class 2/3 chute, with no actual exposure, to the right of the big rock outcropping visible in the background. Though if you keep going to the right (south), you get into class 3 and then class 4 territory...

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#40299 - 09/18/14 08:00 PM Re: Mt. Langley or White Mt Peak, Oct 4&5 [Re: Akichow]
wagga Offline


Registered: 10/07/09
Posts: 2211
Loc: Humbug Reach (Pop. 3)
Originally Posted By: Akichow
Cairns-from-Hell. Megacairns. Cairns-on-Steroids. Feh.

Hey! I live in Cairns. I resent that!
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#40307 - 09/19/14 09:02 AM Re: Mt. Langley or White Mt Peak, Oct 4&5 [Re: wagga]
wbtravis Offline


Registered: 09/22/09
Posts: 1239
Loc: Corner of Jack Benny and Roche...
Hmmm...it would take a while but I'm up to the task. However, I have seen Mt. Langley a few times and am not interested in seeing it anytime soon.

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