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#41071 - 11/25/14 11:51 PM Star gazing
Steve C Offline


Registered: 09/22/09
Posts: 7233
Loc: Fresno, CA
These are posted on Facebook by Dave Clock in the JMT group:

"This is at Humphrey's basin, Summit Lake just beyond the tent."







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#41074 - 11/26/14 08:20 AM Re: Star gazing [Re: Steve C]
saltydog Offline


Registered: 02/03/11
Posts: 1549
Loc: Valley Ford CA!!!!
There are some intriguing details in these shots, such as the clouds covering some stars but not others, but the most interesting detail to me is the spiral in the lower left on the Humphrey's basin shot. Anyone know what that could be?
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#41077 - 11/26/14 10:07 AM Re: Star gazing [Re: saltydog]
John Sims Offline


Registered: 04/20/12
Posts: 524
Loc: Sunnyvale, California
Originally Posted By: saltydog
There are some intriguing details in these shots, such as the clouds covering some stars but not others, but the most interesting detail to me is the spiral in the lower left on the Humphrey's basin shot. Anyone know what that could be?


Perhaps an aircraft in a two loop holding pattern or two loop sight seeing/.....?

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#41078 - 11/26/14 03:42 PM Re: Star gazing [Re: John Sims]
saltydog Offline


Registered: 02/03/11
Posts: 1549
Loc: Valley Ford CA!!!!
Sounds like a winner. That may be the message of the shot: here you are at Humphrey's basin, chillin in the starlight, with all those people in a holding pattern over Fresno.

OK here's another puzzler: maybe busting the photog? The second shot is unmistakeably at the north shore of Thousand Island Lake, looking west to Banner peak. SO how can the apparent arcs of the stars be concentric with a point somewhere to the left, to the south?
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#41079 - 11/26/14 04:22 PM Re: Star gazing [Re: saltydog]
John Sims Offline


Registered: 04/20/12
Posts: 524
Loc: Sunnyvale, California
Originally Posted By: saltydog


OK here's another puzzler: maybe busting the photog? The second shot is unmistakeably at the north shore of Thousand Island Lake, looking west to Banner peak. SO how can the apparent arcs of the stars be concentric with a point somewhere to the left, to the south?



In neither the first nor second picture do the reflections of the star tracks look correct. In the second picture, there are no reflected star tracks (should be on the left side), I do not understand the horizontal band of light middle right, and in the first picture the reflected star tracks seem "off set". Me thinks the sky's have been photoshopped into the images. Just my .02

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#41080 - 11/26/14 05:09 PM Re: Star gazing [Re: John Sims]
saltydog Offline


Registered: 02/03/11
Posts: 1549
Loc: Valley Ford CA!!!!
Originally Posted By: John Sims
Originally Posted By: saltydog


OK here's another puzzler: maybe busting the photog? The second shot is unmistakeably at the north shore of Thousand Island Lake, looking west to Banner peak. SO how can the apparent arcs of the stars be concentric with a point somewhere to the left, to the south?



In neither the first nor second picture do the reflections of the star tracks look correct. In the second picture, there are no reflected star tracks (should be on the left side), I do not understand the horizontal band of light middle right, and in the first picture the reflected star tracks seem "off set". Me thinks the sky's have been photoshopped into the images. Just my .02


Actually the third one is wrong, too: the arcs and angles on the left side are very different. The band of bright light in the TLI shot actually makes sense: headlights and camps to the west. The star tracks in the first shot are also way too dense: like a double or triple exposure, and none of the time-lapse skies match with the snapshot foregrounds.

All in all, some ok visual puzzles but otherwise: meh.


Edited by saltydog (11/26/14 05:24 PM)
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#41081 - 11/26/14 10:13 PM Re: Star gazing [Re: saltydog]
John Sims Offline


Registered: 04/20/12
Posts: 524
Loc: Sunnyvale, California
Originally Posted By: saltydog



Actually the third one is wrong, too: the arcs and angles on the left side are very different. The band of bright light in the TLI shot actually makes sense: headlights and camps to the west. The star tracks in the first shot are also way too dense: like a double or triple exposure, and none of the time-lapse skies match with the snapshot foregrounds.

All in all, some ok visual puzzles but otherwise: meh.


Yes, it would seem the artist was interested in adding a few clouds for dramatic effect (I guess), so added two separate sky shots.

I doubt the objective was to present visual puzzles, but to simply craft some more interesting pictures using "artistic license". For me that is taking post processing a bit too far, although I do admit to twisting the saturation, hue, vibrance, etc... knobs to suit my pleasure:-) What the camera sensor and the human eye capture are not the same, so for me these adjustments seem fair. I do not object to the artists actions. Just not for me.

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#41082 - 11/27/14 12:37 AM Re: Star gazing [Re: John Sims]
Steve C Offline


Registered: 09/22/09
Posts: 7233
Loc: Fresno, CA
Hmmm... I think you guys are being too critical.

> The second shot is unmistakeably at the north shore of Thousand Island Lake, looking west to Banner peak. SO how can the apparent arcs of the stars be concentric with a point somewhere to the left, to the south?

The point is the South Pole! Think down through the Earth and a little to the left. That arc appears about right to me.

> In neither the first nor second picture do the reflections of the star tracks look correct. In the second picture, there are no reflected star tracks (should be on the left side), I do not understand the horizontal band of light middle right, and in the first picture the reflected star tracks seem "off set". Me thinks the sky's have been photoshopped into the images.

Actually, in the second, if you look closely at the only place there could/should be a reflection, you can see a faint reflection of the lowest arc, where it touches the crest of the ridge.
In the first picture, the stars are really bright. But think about it: The stars are burning into the digital camera's sensor for hours. How that sensor projects the image has much to do with its dynamics and electronics characteristics.

> Actually the third one is wrong, too: the arcs and angles on the left side are very different.
Lens distortion! Photographers pay big bucks for lenses that maintain straight lines out to the corners of their pictures. Notice the oval shape around the North Star area in the first picture.

> it would seem the artist was interested in adding a few clouds for dramatic effect
Those pictures are time-exposures taken over hours of time. Clouds are going to look strange, since they move. Think about the time-exposures of streams and cascades -- they make the water look way different too.

...But I am still puzzled about the circles in the lower left of the first picture. I really don't think an aircraft could do that.

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#41083 - 11/27/14 12:48 AM Re: Star gazing [Re: Steve C]
Steve C Offline


Registered: 09/22/09
Posts: 7233
Loc: Fresno, CA
Now I see Saltydog asked the photographer about the effects in the FB thread. DC replied that these are taken with a super wide-angle lens. ...so angles do get distorted.

Also, he wrote, "depending on how cold it is, I can get 2 sometimes 3 nightime shots per battery. Because I am stacking images, i am shooting anywhere between 90-250 images then stacking into a single once I get home and process it all"

I think that explains the intensity of the star tracks in the first picture.

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#41084 - 11/27/14 07:28 AM Re: Star gazing [Re: Steve C]
63ChevyII.com Offline


Registered: 08/07/12
Posts: 670
Loc: Colton, California
Originally Posted By: Steve C

...But I am still puzzled about the circles in the lower left of the first picture. I really don't think an aircraft could do that.


Trying to figure out what you guys are talking about. Are the circles the copyright/watermark?
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#41085 - 11/27/14 07:40 AM Re: Star gazing [Re: 63ChevyII.com]
Fishmonger Offline


Registered: 01/07/10
Posts: 1025
Loc: Madison, WI
Originally Posted By: 63ChevyII.com
Originally Posted By: Steve C

...But I am still puzzled about the circles in the lower left of the first picture. I really don't think an aircraft could do that.


Trying to figure out what you guys are talking about. Are the circles the copyright/watermark?


yep, either that, or some alien spacecraft smile

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#41086 - 11/27/14 09:45 AM Re: Star gazing [Re: Fishmonger]
SierraNevada Offline


Registered: 09/05/11
Posts: 1100
Loc: NorCal
Geosynchronous orbiting satellite. Different circles from different exposures.


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#41087 - 11/27/14 09:49 AM Re: Star gazing [Re: SierraNevada]
SierraNevada Offline


Registered: 09/05/11
Posts: 1100
Loc: NorCal
Another mystery, is the Marmot tent at TIL legally camped near the water? Or is it just a prop?


Edited by SierraNevada (11/27/14 09:50 AM)

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#41088 - 11/27/14 10:04 AM Re: Star gazing [Re: saltydog]
marmoting Offline


Registered: 09/22/10
Posts: 12
Loc: CA
I think the circle in the image is a copyright symbol. You can see the shading on it to give it a 3-dimensional look.

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#41089 - 11/27/14 10:31 AM Re: Star gazing [Re: marmoting]
SierraNevada Offline


Registered: 09/05/11
Posts: 1100
Loc: NorCal
I'm still leaning toward alien surveillance. smile

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#41090 - 11/27/14 10:32 AM Re: Star gazing [Re: marmoting]
saltydog Offline


Registered: 02/03/11
Posts: 1549
Loc: Valley Ford CA!!!!
On FB, Dave explains a couple of things: the left handed arcs are of the soutern sky, which makes sense, and the mystery circles are his copyright mark.
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Wherever you go, there you are.
SPOTMe!

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#41091 - 11/27/14 10:35 AM Re: Star gazing [Re: saltydog]
SierraNevada Offline


Registered: 09/05/11
Posts: 1100
Loc: NorCal
So you're telling us he's an alien.

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#41092 - 11/27/14 10:40 AM Re: Star gazing [Re: Steve C]
RoguePhotonic Offline


Registered: 12/08/09
Posts: 558
Loc: Bakersfield CA
The brightness of the stars is the work of the photographer. I often ramp up the brightness levels on the stars to max in order to make them pop out more when I edit star photos.

Clouds and stars overlapping is simply the movement of the clouds and having clear sky one moment but not the next and having a ghost image.

The circle could be a satellite but honestly I see so many weird things taking photos of the stars or just laying out watching them that I wonder if more than satellites, space stations and shuttles are flying around at times.

Last year while taking photos I caught an object moving slow across many exposures. The satellites would all burn the same 2 inch or more line in the shot while this one was moving an 8th inch across the photo. It also did not have the same light pattern.


Edited by RoguePhotonic (11/27/14 10:45 AM)
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#41093 - 11/27/14 10:44 AM Re: Star gazing [Re: SierraNevada]
RoguePhotonic Offline


Registered: 12/08/09
Posts: 558
Loc: Bakersfield CA
Originally Posted By: SierraNevada
Geosynchronous orbiting satellite. Different circles from different exposures.




How do these satellites work? It's always been my understanding that in order to avoid falling back down to earth they have to maintain the magic number in speed to fall forever in a circle. If one can make loops like that is it using some sort of propulsion to maintain it's orbit?
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#41094 - 11/27/14 12:31 PM Re: Star gazing [Re: RoguePhotonic]
SierraNevada Offline


Registered: 09/05/11
Posts: 1100
Loc: NorCal
Geosynchronous satellites do figure 8 loops above and below the equator while also going retrograde (west to east) from earth's perspective. This could theoretically create a circular ground track (earthbound perspective). The looping is a daily event, so you shouldn't see the complete circle in one evening, but then again, you don't see complete circles in this photo. On the other hand, these circles are very bright. I can argue both sides. So this theory seems remotely plausible, but the truth seems to be that the photographer is actually covering up for alien spacecraft.

Notice this photo is the only one of the three that has the "copyright" included with the photographer name. So it's doubly redundant that he would alter his photo with a fake "C" burned into the sky while also including "copyright" with his name.

Alien conspirator, that's my story and I'm sticking with it. wink

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