Hello everyone,

This will be my first trip up Mt. Whitney. I will be climbing Mt. Shasta on September 2nd and then Mt. Whitney on October 1st.

Does anyone have any experience on the mountain in early October? What can I expect from the mountain during this time of the year? Any advice, suggestions, etc?

Thanks!

Welcome to WhitneyZone, lawnerd! And congratulations on scoring the permit.

In the other section, you wrote:
This is my first trip to Whitney. I posted a topic under General Discussion for advice! Sounds good thus far! Thanks!

As Bee wrote, Whitney can be quite pleasant in the fall.

But the biggest warning I can give is to watch the weather forecasts. It can be dry and calm, but October usually sees the first winter storm hit, too. If any significant weather is predicted just prior to your hike, I'd cancel if I were you. If a storm passes through a week or more before your hike, the trail can have some snow to tramp through, too. It won't be terribly deep that early, but it could slow your progress.

The one thing you might keep in mind, if you want to try earlier in the season, there are often many unused permits available, especially mid-week days. Check the Unused permits numbers from last year. If you went a few weeks earlier than Oct 1, your odds for foul weather would be lower.

It will most likely be cold up high and there is a significant chance of snow, about a 1/3 of my October Eastern Sierra trips I've seen snow on the ground.

My last Whitney Trail ended 9/21/09. The temperature on the summit at dawn was just below freezing but I've experienced much colder in August and during another September trip.

I was snowed out of my first Whitney trip (late August 1964, 4" snow at Trail Camp). Typical hot dry day on lower half of the trail. Probably 85-90 at Mirror Lake. Noticed cloud cover building at Trailside Meadow. By 4:00 pm at Trail Camp, overcast and temp dropping, starting to mist and drizzle. By next morning it was about 25F and clear, 4" snow on the ground .

Trip leader called it based on his view that such early winter weather systems typically ran several days, and that we could therefore expect to get snow for the next 5-7 days in the high country we were bound for (Lake South America). I never really determined whether this was a sound analysis or a convenient story. On the plane from LA to SF a few days later, however, there was still fresh snow visible down at least to 10,000', so as far as I know, the prediction held up. Anyone have experience with early winter systems dumping snow for several nights running?

My 3 Whitney ascents since (2 summits) were all in June and July.

I try to do Whitney twice a year - spring and fall - and the fall dates for the last four years are 9/12/07, 9/25/08, 9/28/09 and 9/15/10. Living nearby, I keep my eye on the weather and go before the first major storm. In a least 2 of those years, that storm occurred within a week or so after those dates. Does the first storm shut the mountain down? That all depends - if you live in a snowy climate, then it's probably no big deal. OTH, if you've never hiked in snow before, maybe it is.

Hopes this helps in terms of dates and planning.

Sounds like so long as I have some experience traveling on snow with the proper gear I should be okay?

If you let conditions dictate how far you go and not the destination, you should be ok.

How many people return home on summit day vs. staying another night at Whitney Portal?

I have done it both ways. If there is an opportunity to rest (potentially shower) overnight before the potentially long drive, I would much more prefer to leave in the morning (I prefer travelling in the morning vs night travel)

My first summit was on October 4th, 2009. The weather was gorgeous. I was very happy to see the Sun when I passed Trail Camp, so I could warm up, but again, near perfect. If my memory serves me correct, it snowed just a few days later. Have a super time!

Awesome! Thanks, I hope for the same!

General question. I'm a little confused regarding exit dates. Do you have to exit the trail on your exit date? I have heard that it is good for a certain amount of days? How does that work.

lawnerd, if you have an overnight permit, it is good for up to 14 days. You do NOT need to exit the date declared on your reservation or on your permit. They do like to record your planned exit date so they might have an idea whether to start looking for you if you are reported missing. And possibly for statistical purposes.

The only place an "exit" date is required is those people hiking out the MMWT (main Mt Whitney trail), who have started on another trail within the Inyo National Forest. They imposed a quota of 25 per day on those permits after they found a large number of people were coming in from Horseshoe Meadows and Onion Valley to climb Whitney and exit the MMWT.

As for driving home on summit day -- I have often done that, and my drive is farther than yours. I find I am especially charged up after a good day on the mountain, and my body is very happy to sit in a comfortable bucket seat and do nothing for hours after all that exercise.

Yea, I think I will drive home on Summit Day. I was concerned about being too tired to drive. There will be two others with me so hopefully between the three of us we can manage to make it. How long does it typically take you to reach Fresno from the mountain?

about 4+ hours, 5 if you start from the Portal, and figure in stops. Google maps puts Exeter only about 25 minutes shorter.

Lawnerd,
A lot will depend on how tired you are.

Last year I spent the night at trail camp and pretty much got no sleep. After summiting and then going all the way back to the portal, I was pretty exhausted. But I started the drive home anyway. It was all i could do to keep my eyes open until I found the rest stop 40 or so miles south of Lone Pine. I slept a solid 6 hours at the rest stop reclined in my front seat.

If you feel invigorated after the hike and had a good night's sleep the night before...probably not too much of an issue. Else, better to get some rest and live to hike another day.

Good advice, td. My buddy I hiked with could not stay awake after our hikes. I'd drive and he'd be passed out. So it just depends.... Most importantly, BE SAFE!

I also have tried it both ways.

I live in Sacramento. Mapquest says "6 hrs 28 mins / 335.20 miles".

The two times I drove thru to home were the two most miserable drives in my LIFE! I barely remember them and looking back I don't see how I made it. I certainly don't remember much of those drives!

** serious question ** What's more dangerous, the mountain activity, hiking, climbing etc, or the drive to and from the mountain?

Another two trips back from Whitney I stopped at the side of the road at the 120/395 junction and slept the night. Completely transformed the drive back into a glorious experience, sleeping in the car with the moon lighting up the Mono Lake Basin, waking up as the sun starts to warm up the car, breakfast at Whoa Nelli, morning light (something I don't normally see) on Lee Vining Canyon, Tioga Pass, and the rest of Yosemite, arriving home in the middle of the day, all makes the end of a trip a completely different experience.

Great advice everyone. It's greatly appreciated. I'm thinking a night in Lone Pine with a hot shower and warm meal.

Lawnerd,
I am going to be on the trail Oct 1st with 10 of my friends as well. Are you doing a day hike or camping? I attempted a day hike 9 years ago with 3 other people and 3/4 of us didn't make it due to AMS. We went in late Sept and had beautiful weather. I am hoping for the same luck in weather. I figured we would have better luck this time if we camped on the trail. Maybe our paths will cross.

Charged up, yes; but exhausted, very yes!
U.S. 395 heading either direction is a long, dark, mostly straight-for-miles it-all-looks-alike hypnotic road at night, esp. when you're exhausted. Like others above, I don't know how I ever made it to where I was staying (in the Palmdale area) from Lone Pine when driving there the same night as my hike day. I would seriously consider staying in Lone Pine, clean up, sleep, relax, eat, etc. and then head home the following morning refreshed and with the sunlight on the road (395 is a very beautiful drive along the mountains, which beauty is wasted by driving at night when you can't see it).

CaT

I've returned home the same day most of the time but I summit at on near dawn on my trips so, I'm in the Portal early, showered, pigged out, on road and back in SoCal at a reasonable hour.

Chickadee,

I will be camping. I have reserved a site at Whitney Portal Campground for Sept. 30th. I plan to get to Trail Camp or C. Lake on the 1st, Summit on the 2nd and it looks like I will be staying in Lone Pine and leaving on the 3rd. I too am hoping for good weather. I'm not afraid of the snow, I just don't want any problems.

I want to do an overnight trip for both acclimation and just because I want to be away from the valley for more than a day! I think the trip will be more pleasant this way. Have you thought much about your plans for the mountain? I would be interested to hear how far you plan to get the first day, etc. This is my first trip to Whitney. Thanks!

(emphasis mine)

Chickadee and lawnerd:

Acclimation is about the most important factor ensuring a successful summit. Lawnerd's plan to camp one night at the Portal, and a second on the trail is about the minimum required for any sort of acclimation.

If you start up the trail first day, and camp one night, that isn't enough time for most people.

A good acclimatization plan would be to spend one or two nights at Horseshoe Meadows campground -- elev 10,000 -- and maybe doing an easy dayhike for fun, to either Trail Peak or Cottonwood Lakes.  Here's a Trail Peak writeup:  Trail Peak: Warmup / acclimatization hike.  I can assure you, at the end of September, there will be plenty of available space in that campground.

"I can assure you, at the end of September, there will be plenty of available space in that campground."

There were plenty of campsites labor day weekend last year when I was there.

I plan on one or two nights at Whitney portal, I have to reserve them still.
We stayed there two nights last time as well. I am very aware of the effects of
altitude and plan to camp at 12,000' on the trail.
My husband and I are very sensitive to altitude and did well
on Kilimanjaro this past fall. We used Diamox, which we plan to use again
for Whitney.

If I can take more time off, I would love to spend more time in the Sierra's,
but that may not happen.

Altitude sickness is crazy and you just never know how it will effect you.

Steve,

I've come to believe if you have a problem with AMS you are liable to have problems, with any "short" program. I spent a day 2 days near 10,000' with absolutely no problems then did White Mtn. I was fine until I started to eat on the summit and came down my worse case of AMS I have ever had. The symptoms did not go away until I was in Big Pine for an hour.

As you know, I am a Diamox user but I know if I push it the first couple of days out I am going to have problems, sleep, lack of appetite and headache being the usual symptoms.

It is my belief, you have to come up to the Sierra to play to find out if you have these problems prior to your day with destiny. Most folks don't mind missing Langley or White because of AMS but Whitney is another matter entirely. By coming up a month to six weeks before your trip, you can address these problems before you big day/multi-day.This is an inexpensive insurance policy because the next opportunity for many is a year and another lottery drawing away.

wbtravis wrote:
I've come to believe if you have a problem with AMS you are liable to have problems, with any "short" program. I spent a day 2 days near 10,000' with absolutely no problems then did White Mtn. I was fine until I started to eat on the summit and came down my worse case of AMS I have ever had.

WB, I still experience some symptoms after several days, too. But what I am trying to suggest for Chickadee and lawnerd is to spend enough time acclimating to mitigate the worst symptoms, so they will at least succeed in making the summit.

They may not be dancing on the summit but at least they have a much better chance of making it.

I'm basically saying the same thing but I have a slight different method. This is based on most folks who do Mt. Whitney come from SoCal. If they can get to Mt. Whitney, they can also get to White Mtn. or Langley to find out if elevation is going to be a problem and if it is they can do something about it.

To me and you, this is just another mountain. If we miss it for any reason, we know it will be there the next time we want to do it. However, for many of this is year's worth of planning, a ton of bucks and if they don't summit another year of disappointment. Wifey got really depressed after doing what is still her longest hike with the most gain but her day ended at Trail Crest.

After coming to the Sierra year after year and playing at these higher elevations, I know what to expect. I believe this to be as important as being acclimatized. Of course, I come after taking Diamox for 3 days and know enough not to push too hard the first couple of days in these mountains. I know if I do, I will not be able to eat and most likely sleep well that night but I know in the morning I'm going to be ok. That come from experience, experience most every SoCal noob can pick up just by visiting High Sierra or Whites a month to six weeks before their trip.

I love the Sierra in October. The peeps are semi-gone and it's cool to cold, which makes for great hiking in my mind. But, I have a ton of gear and clothes and prepared for most of what Mother Nature throws at me.

I live very near Sequoia National Park, so I plan to get up there to do some training hikes before October rolls around. I will be on Mt. Shasta for the first week of September so that should give me a good idea of how I do at altitude. However, I will have more time on Shasta to acclimate.

I will be running short of vacation days and time on Mt. Whitney. I only have three days time to get it done. Hopefully I will be able to acclimate in that time frame. If I had more time I would surely use it.

Would it help to take Diamox before the trip, even if I am not at altitude?

Lawnerd,
We took 125 mg Diamox twice a day starting the first day in altitude and continued until we had descended on Kilimanjaro. It worked well. Check with your MD. It's really important to drink lots of fluids and eat! Diamox is a diuretic and it will make you urinate. It also has a side effect of pins and needles. Also, take your time on the trail. A slower hike helps you acclimate. We too only have Friday - Sunday. My boss wouldn't give me any more days off. We plan on heading to Whitney Portal on Thursday night. Hope that helps.
Chickadee

Sorry, I didn't answer your question. It's good to try it before your trip just to see how your body reacts to it.

lawnerd, the weekend before Whitney, day hike Sawtooth peak out of Mineral King (if they haven't locked the gate by then).

It will get you over 12k elevation, and if you go just a week before, will give you a start on the acclimatization.

And a bonus-- it has great views of Mt. Whitney from the west.

I'm not big on Diamox unless you have experienced AMS. It is a drug that does have some, let's say, interesting side effects. Also, it takes a while to get a dosing regiment that works for you. For me, it was a process that I figured out in 3 or 4 years of using the drug 3 or 4 times a year, since I am only affected by AMS on day hikes like Whitney and multi-day trips over 10,000'.

Time is an issue for most of us who spend time in the Sierra, mine is usually Friday night up, Saturday out and Sunday home. This limits the trips I can do. I don't have time to acclimatize properly. So, I put up with the AMS symptoms and the Diamox side effects. I usually feel great as I am walking out of the forest.

See this thread for informed dosage for Diamox. Both Ken and Harvey Langford are MD's with lots of experience hiking and climbing.

Steve C,

Thanks for all of your valuable info. I was planning on using Sawtooth for training and just because it looks cool and i've always wanted to climb it. Any other good hikes in the area you would recommend for training?

> Any other good hikes in the area you would recommend for training?

Alta Peak in Sequoia comes to mind. Make a loop out of it by taking the trail to the summit, then head east and north off the summit, descending to Pear Lake. Return to Wolverton parking area via the Pear Lake trail. That hike gave me a good day's workout!

And you can barely see Whitney's summit from Alta, too.