Mt Whitney Zone
Posted By: DUG Quick trip to San Jacinto - 06/20/10 04:04 PM
My wife got called in to do overtime Saturday so the boy and I packed our Camelbaks and headed to Idyllwild. Plan was simple - a quick trip to the summit via the Marion Mountain Trail. Last year it was our first hike of the season and it almost made me want to quit hiking forever. It's fairly steep, gaining 4500 feet in just under 6 miles.

Woke up at 0330 and was rolling before 0400. Grabbed a permit and parked at the trailhead. A few weeks ago we turned back at 9000 feet due to snow on the PCT coming up via Devil's Slide. This time there was no snow until Little Round Valley and it was easy to stay on trail.

There was some snow during the last 100 feet but it was soft and easy to scamble up. I read later that if you swing around the other side it isn't a problem. Wasn't really a problem plowing through it either.

Lots of water on the trail so no need to carry much if you don't want to.

When we arrived there were four others on top. Two of them left after they took our photo. After about a half hour the crowds started coming up. There was a line to get on to the summit block.

We headed down and thought we had seen the last of our fellow hikers as we turned away from the Tram route. WRONG. There were at least 40 people coming up our way including a group of 20 single file hiking through Little Round Valley. Crazy. Everyone we talked to said they were coming up Marion Mountain, but the Deer Springs trailhead parking was completely full when we passed.

The key to enjoying San J's peak is be the early bird. 1st tram leaves at 0800 - get a jump on them and you'll have peace at the top.

Team Snail is going up San J on the 27th via South Ridge/Tahquitz.

I'm supposed to lead a 20 mile merit badge hike up there this summer - up the tram, to the peak and downhill to Idyllwild.

Looks like I'll be a frequent visitor this year.............DUG
Posted By: DUG Re: Quick trip to San Jacinto - 06/28/10 12:34 PM
Went back to San J Sunday for our practice hike. Everyone was loaded up with the exact gear they plam to have Friday on Whitney. Woke up at 0100, got ready and met up with everyone at 0200. Made the drive to Idyllwild, pulled a permit (which was checked twice) and was hiking by headlamp at 0330. Two members had never used a headlamp before. Enjoyed sunrise and breakfast at the fire lookout on Tahquitz Peak. Quickly dropped 700 feet along the spur trail/PCT before hitting Saddle Junction. From there it's just uphill. Weather was incredible all day - never got too cold or windy or too hot. Spent a 1/2 hour on the peak and headed down.

We took 15 hours on the trail hiking 22 miles and gaining 5900 feet total in elevation. My Whitney plan calls for 18 hours so I think we are doing ok.

Right now I have a turn around time planned for 1200, but might stretch it to 1300 depending on weather, etc. Does that sound reasonible? We are hitting the trail at 0200 and I expect a slower pace than on San J.

#1 goal is to return home safely, #2 is to summit. How many hours it takes to complete these goals doesn't matter to me, we aren't trying to impress anyone. My thoughts are as long as we are headed downhill with enough gear to hold us overnight in an emergancy than it doesn't matter if it takes us 12 hours to finish the hike or 22.

Thoughts?..................................DUG
Posted By: + @ti2d Re: Quick trip to San Jacinto - 06/28/10 02:52 PM
Originally Posted By: DUG
...Right now I have a turn around time planned for 1200, but might stretch it to 1300 depending on weather, etc. Does that sound reasonible? We are hitting the trail at 0200 and I expect a slower pace than on San J.

#1 goal is to return home safely, #2 is to summit. How many hours it takes to complete these goals doesn't matter to me, we aren't trying to impress anyone. My thoughts are as long as we are headed downhill with enough gear to hold us overnight in an emergancy than it doesn't matter if it takes us 12 hours to finish the hike or 22.

Thoughts?..................................DUG


A 1200 or 1300 turnaround time is good since you are starting at 0200. 1300 has always been my cutoff time regardless of start time.

Pace pace pace
Hydrate hydrate hydrate
Nibble nibble nibble

Getting to the top is OPTIONAL, getting down is MANDATORY. I am sure you already know that.

Another axiom (from Kurt Wedberg): No higher than a headache.

Water sources (no filtration needed): Spring just before Outpost. SB23. Dependent upon temperature, the water could be flowing by the time you get there. Trailside Meadow is a place to chill out for a while.

TC to summit: I count 100 paces, stop, rest, drink. Then another 100. Takes my mind off seeing the summit in the distance. Another step closer.

Mountaineer's breaths: Purse your lips like you are going to blow out a candle at arm's length. Exhale forcibly. Take a deep breath and repeat. Expands the alveolar sacs in your lungs.

Hope this helps...

Have fun.
Posted By: DUG Re: Quick trip to San Jacinto - 07/10/10 04:05 AM
Back to Sanny J for the 4th time this year with the third successful summit (our first trip via Devil's Slide had too much snow).

This time was Fuller Ridge. Met four people at the ranger station pulling a permit for Devil's Slide. Told them we would see them on top - we had about the same distance to hike. Except our trail head was up 8 miles crap road that the 2500HD GMC Crew cab hated. The diesel anchors the front and I wished I had something in the bed for weight. Rides like a truck too.

Found the TH finally and quickly knocked out a couple miles. Wasn't bad, even with the late start. The boy was hurting after staying up late to watch TV. He kept going, but his pace was off.

It seems Fuller Ridge is uphill both ways. Nice steep climbs and huge decents. I knew it would suck coming home and it did not let me down.

Got those 5ish miles done and headed up toward Little Round Valley and the summit. Met up with three guys who were a blast to talk to. Their pace was slightly slower so we kept pulling away. Mike was tired and not paying attention in a tight spot on the trail and just barely stepped on a rattler. I heard it and caught a glimpse of it and instectively jerked back on his pack. It seemed like the snake was completely across the trail with the rattles in one bush and the head in another. Maybe he was just crossing. He coiled up under a bush and seemed POed. I didn't get a good look at him, but the guys who we had been hiking with off and on came by and took a few pics as best they could. One guy said he was thick as a wrist and maybe 6 feet. So it was probably pencil thin and two feet. Hopefully they will remember my email addy and I'll get a pic.

Mike perked up after that and we finished the hike to the summit. We arrived about 10 minutes after the folks we saw at the ranger station. There were just eight of total at the top. Only two tiny snow patches remained. Took the summit pics, ate and headed down.

Mike tanked up on water, I thought I had enough. Back down the trail the snake was still making noise. Again, those three guys showed up and with no other way around we beat on the bushes with a stick after the rattling had stopped. No other noise was made so we assumed he was gone and passed the choke point.

Fuller Ridge was less than fun with it's returning uphill, but we made the best of it. 20 minutes after the last water on the trail I ran out. The boy shared. Good kid.

So we did it, got the check in the block and learned a few things. Still need to re do Devil's Slide, then do Seven Pines, Deer Spings, the tram and C2C2C (Oct 9). Three down, five to go...............................DUG
Posted By: Rod Re: Quick trip to San Jacinto - 07/12/10 03:00 AM
You Rock DUGGERs. Crazy about Mike almost stepping on a rattler.I hate rattlers.Way too many in my yard over the years.With the kids I had too many close calls.
Posted By: DUG Re: Quick trip to San Jacinto - 07/12/10 03:03 AM
When are we going on an EPIC Rod?......................DUG
Posted By: Rod Re: Quick trip to San Jacinto - 07/13/10 05:25 AM
Unless I get back in shape again after being off a couple of months the epic will be you carrying me down the mountain on your shoulders.Maybe i can join you and Mike on one of your Jacinto hikes.
I am up for a little hike possibly in the next week or two to Lone Pine Lake to see what shape i am in.Maybe i'll head over to Hike out of Cottonwoods or Horsehoe Meadows.I am waiting results of my dads brain surgery today. He had a shunt put in to drain cerebral spinal fluid (hydrocephalus)off his brain.The surgery well well but we are on a wait and see on how he recovers.
Posted By: DUG Re: Quick trip to San Jacinto - 07/14/10 01:28 AM
Praying for your dad Rod!

Any chance you can make the group hike to Candlelight?

I want to do Deer Springs in early Aug. LMK if you want to come along. It would be great to have you................DUG
Posted By: Rod Re: Quick trip to San Jacinto - 07/14/10 04:26 AM
When and where is the group hike to Candlelight? i haven't been able to check the board as much as i would like to lately.
Posted By: DUG Re: Quick trip to San Jacinto - 07/14/10 04:35 AM
July 31st. Where? Near Candlelight! LOL - Kewl kids are taking the easy way via Meysan. Hardcore mofos are going via LPL. Me and the boy plan on heading up the night before, Moose huntin for dinner and then sleeping at the Meysan TH. You should come along......................DUG
Posted By: Rod Re: Quick trip to San Jacinto - 07/14/10 05:13 AM
I am going to try to work that out.Sounds fun.I am a little out of shape. Havent worked out in 2 months but I do have years of training to fall back on.Some residual of it has got to still be there right? If dad is stable I will try to make it up to the Portal to hike to LPL this Saturday afternoon to test my conditioning or lack there of.And sorry to sound stupid but I didn't know where Candlelight was.
Posted By: SoCalGirl Re: Quick trip to San Jacinto - 07/14/10 09:09 PM
Originally Posted By: DUG
July 31st. Where? Near Candlelight! LOL - Kewl kids are taking the easy way via Meysan. Hardcore mofos are going via LPL. Me and the boy plan on heading up the night before, Moose huntin for dinner and then sleeping at the Meysan TH. You should come along......................DUG


You and Mike going on this DUGster?
Posted By: DUG Re: Quick trip to San Jacinto - 07/15/10 03:46 AM
Originally Posted By: SoCalGirl
Originally Posted By: DUG
July 31st. Where? Near Candlelight! LOL - Kewl kids are taking the easy way via Meysan. Hardcore mofos are going via LPL. Me and the boy plan on heading up the night before, Moose huntin for dinner and then sleeping at the Meysan TH. You should come along......................DUG


You and Mike going on this DUGster?


Yeah! You coming?.......................DUG
Posted By: SoCalGirl Re: Quick trip to San Jacinto - 07/15/10 04:20 PM
I don't know... I took a look at the "guest" list...
Posted By: DUG Re: Quick trip to San Jacinto - 07/15/10 04:28 PM
Originally Posted By: SoCalGirl
I don't know... I took a look at the "guest" list...


? I'll be there and lots of other kewl people. So what if some evil, $;&?)(), is gonna be there? Don't let her run your life. Wait until she sees my Flickr comments! LOL............DUG
Posted By: SoCalGirl Re: Quick trip to San Jacinto - 07/15/10 06:33 PM
10 miles round trip, right? I'm not sporting the best of shape right now...
Posted By: MooseTracks Re: Quick trip to San Jacinto - 07/15/10 08:33 PM
And you can turn around wherever you choose. Dun need to go to the top: journey, lilsis, journey...
Posted By: SoCalGirl Re: Quick trip to San Jacinto - 07/15/10 10:44 PM
My own summit, right bigsis?....
Posted By: DUG Re: Quick trip to San Jacinto - 07/16/10 01:14 AM
Originally Posted By: MooseTracks
And you can turn around wherever you choose. Dun need to go to the top: journey, lilsis, journey...


And my man "Sherpa Mike" will be there. Go packless and free. What are kids for? Carpool up even. Man this deal is getting good. Moose huntin' for dinner, the kewl kids all together, a punk hike with a sherpa that you can bail from at any time - um, HOW can you say no? I dare say you CAN'T.............................DUG
Posted By: MooseTracks Re: Quick trip to San Jacinto - 07/16/10 03:00 AM
NOW y'all are talkin' sense... grin
Posted By: DUG Re: Quick trip to San Jacinto - 08/07/10 11:22 PM
BACK to San Jacinto! We have decided to go up via every trail this year. Since Mike's ears are AFU he couldn't go on his Scout Troop's scuba trip today so we went and knocked out Devil's Slide. We now have Seven Pines, Deer Springs and C2C2C left. The biggie out of Palm Springs is scheduled 09 Oct with a group so we won't get lost. We MIGHT go up the tram route and tag the peak, but I tell you, that feels dirty - like cheating. So maybe not.

Anyway we hit the road at 0400, pulled a permit and got to Humbler at 0515. We only had one headlamp between us so we dozed in the car until 0545. Got on the trail and had our permit checked in the 1st five minutes.

It was an easy push up to Saddle Junction, but my stomache was having problems. I was off my game and holding Mike back. He took the lead since he couldn't stand the smell behind. We were forced to break about every mile and half and I wanted to quit every time. Mike stayed positive and upbeat and I didn't want to waste this chance to get a check in the block.

Four painfull hours later we hit the summit. Only four people were there and I was glad we beat the tram herd again. Hung around about 30 minutes and headed down. I wasn't feeling any better and Mike frequently had to turn and wait for me. A half mile down the herds hit big time. I stopped counting at 45 people, but it was a PITA waiting for all of our new uphill friends to hike by. Pushed about 2.5 miles downhill and then I remembered I had some Pepto in my pack. Took some and kept chugging along. We weren't fast, but we got the job done.

Took one last rest stop at Saddle Junction and I felt good. Mike noticed I was hanging behind him and he set a brutal pace. We knocked out the last 2.5 miles in 38 minutes.

Afterwards we both feel great - a sign we might be getting into hiking shape................................DUG
Posted By: Steve C Re: Quick trip to San Jacinto - 08/08/10 04:40 AM
You have a real hiker on your hands, DUG. Hope you have better luck keeping up with him on future hikes.
Posted By: Rod Re: Quick trip to San Jacinto - 08/08/10 06:45 AM
You eating bad saugage again Doug?
Posted By: wazzu Re: Quick trip to San Jacinto - 08/10/10 03:02 AM
DUG, I will be going up Devils Slide this Sat for the first time. Is there any place to refill water along the trail or should I plan on taking a full supply from the start?
Posted By: DUG Re: Quick trip to San Jacinto - 08/10/10 03:44 PM
wazzu - there is a little water after you leave the PCT and head towards the summit. Probably 2 miles from the top where the brush gets thick. It's not a strong flow, but should get the job done for you. My son and I carried four litres each and had plenty left. Have a great hike - we might see you there - we are coming up via Deer Springs and looping around to the south and then coming down on the other side for a big circle........................................DUG
Posted By: wazzu Re: Quick trip to San Jacinto - 08/12/10 05:32 PM
DUG...hope to see you and your son on the trail. You can't miss me. My trekking poles are bright dayglo yellow with LEKI in bright orange...what can I say I bought them almost 20 years ago...I get a lot of comments on the trail from other hikers...usally "WOW those poles really stand out"
Posted By: DUG Re: Quick trip to San Jacinto - 08/12/10 06:09 PM
wazzu - We plan on hitting the trail at 0545 or 0600. It's 6.4 miles to the spot we jump off the PCT and head towards Wellmans Divide - a spot thats 4.3 for you I think. What time are you starting?. We are coming back down through Little ROund Valley so if we don't see you on top or on the way, we won't see you at all. Look for an old fat man with an orange Camelbak and a tall young man with a blue Camelbak..........................DUG
Posted By: wazzu Re: Quick trip to San Jacinto - 08/13/10 04:18 PM
DUG...should be on the trail between 5:30a - 6am. Since this is my first time to the trailhead, giving myself a little leeway for finding the parking lot and the trail. I usually try to be on the trail around 5:30am. I should be able to complete 4.3 miles around 2hrs. I'll keep a look out for you on the top if we don't see each other on the trail.
Posted By: quillansculpture Re: Quick trip to San Jacinto - 08/13/10 04:35 PM
Have a great time guys. I tried to arrange my schedule to be on San Jacinto tomorrow also....but my buddy has a light knee injury and we'll be back to the flats of the Santa Rosa Plateau tomorrow.

I did something yesterday that I haven't done in many, many years. I gave up running after my new hip, but in the last few weeks, I've been putting in some small runs of 2 to 4 miles to change things up between the gym and hikes. Yesterday, I did 7 miles!!!!

Now, if you guys saw me running with my pack, ripped up shorts, long sleeve shirt and flappy sun protection hat, you would probably laugh at me......I don't run fast or with any style at all.

I'm contemplating entering the "Run to the Top" at Mt Baldy on Sept 6th. I haven't run that one in over 11 years, and I hated it back then. But, even though it says Run to the Top......I'm sure nobody will care when they see me walking and coming in last.
Posted By: + @ti2d Re: Quick trip to San Jacinto - 08/13/10 04:40 PM
Originally Posted By: quillansculpture
...I'm sure nobody will care when they see me walking and coming in last.


Just finish what you start! whistle
Posted By: DUG Re: Quick trip to San Jacinto - 08/13/10 06:44 PM
wazzu - Just follow the signs and you won't have any trouble getting to Humbler. I'll be at the ranger station around 0500 pulling the permit...............................DUG
Posted By: DUG Re: Quick trip to San Jacinto - 08/14/10 03:13 PM
EPIC failure - The boy grabbed the wrong underware and said he was getting chaffed pretty bad so we turned back. We'll get it done in two weeks after Whitney...............DUG
Posted By: wazzu Re: Quick trip to San Jacinto - 08/15/10 07:32 PM
DUG, Sorry to hear about the chafing. I made the SJ summit on Sat 8/14, but it wasn't the day I had planned either.

I mentioned my 'training' hikes at a get together over 4th of July wekend. A friend asked if she could tag along on the SJ hike. I said sure, without thinking. I forgot about the agreement until Friday, when she contacted me about the details of meeting for the hike. We had done Mt Wilson in May, when I was just getting into hiking shape, and we did ok together, but this was much higher altitude and I'm in much better hiking shape, as she hasn't been hiking since Mt Wilson. I knew I had to adjust my mental outlook/expectation of the day.

Anyway, it was still a great day, weather was good, nice people on the trail, enjoyed the summit. (Ran in to a group of 15 from San Diego that were training for Whitney. They will be up in a couple of weeks for a day hike) I now understand why Devils Slide is a popular trail. Great views, well maintained.

However, it was a later start than I like, 6:45am, slower pace than I like for a training hike (and I'm no speedster up the trail), took a little over 5.5 hrs to summit. (I orginally gave myself a target of 4 - 4.5 hrs.) And the return downhill was almost as slow. We decided to call the people comming up from the tram: trammers or trammies. I was really glad to get past that trail junction on the way down. It was close to a 10 hr day car-to-car, instead of a 8 hr day. On the car ride home we both agreed my training hikes probably should be solo or with someone else that is more of a morning person and has a little better pace. wink
Posted By: quillansculpture Re: Quick trip to San Jacinto - 08/15/10 07:59 PM
Congrats on the hike. I think 8 hrs sounds about right for a training hike. I'm not too fast either. I'm sure it was beautiful up at the summit as it was a gorgeous day.

Wilson is under rated in my opinion. No altitude, but strong grades. My wife's knee had a tough time up there last year, and earlier this year, I forgot about an appt and had to run most of the way down it.

Any water on Devil's Slide?
Posted By: wazzu Re: Quick trip to San Jacinto - 08/15/10 09:09 PM
There's no running creek/stream right now, there are a couple of stream crossings on the trail however they are dry, but there are 2 springs that cross the trail. Going uphill the 2nd spring has a small pool before it crosses the trail. Deep enough to filter, dip a naglene bottle, or use the trusty sierra cup. They are about 6 miles up the trail, past the Wellman divide. You know you are getting close when you see the grove of ferns or fern like plants. I have never seen such healthy, huge ferns that are in direct sun light. (At least they look like ferns to me, I'm not as good with the plants as I should be) The water flows on the trail, so just keep an eye out for the mud.

Before and after the springs, I could not find any water close to the trail. I carried 2.5 L of water and 1L of electrolyte replacement. Ended the day with less than .5L of water and a small amount of the electrolyte replacement.

Mt Wilson downhill did a number on my knees too. Took about 3 weeks for them to recover. Came down way too fast for the grade.
Posted By: lynn-a-roo Re: Quick trip to San Jacinto - 08/15/10 09:24 PM
Bummer about the water at San Jacinto. My friends and I are training for Mt. Whitney and planned to hike San Jacinto starting from the tram over Labor Day weekend. Does your report cover the trail starting from the tram, or another trail?
Posted By: wazzu Re: Quick trip to San Jacinto - 08/15/10 09:36 PM
Water report is for the Devils Slide trail, which joins the trail from the tram at the Wellman Divide juction. The springs are after this junction. I have no first hand experience from the tram to the Wellman Divide junction.
Posted By: DUG Re: Quick trip to San Jacinto - 08/16/10 12:46 AM
Originally Posted By: wazzu
There's no running creek/stream right now, there are a couple of stream crossings on the trail however they are dry, but there are 2 springs that cross the trail. Going uphill the 2nd spring has a small pool before it crosses the trail. Deep enough to filter, dip a naglene bottle, or use the trusty sierra cup. They are about 6 miles up the trail, past the Wellman divide. You know you are getting close when you see the grove of ferns or fern like plants. I have never seen such healthy, huge ferns that are in direct sun light. (At least they look like ferns to me, I'm not as good with the plants as I should be) The water flows on the trail, so just keep an eye out for the mud.

Before and after the springs, I could not find any water close to the trail. I carried 2.5 L of water and 1L of electrolyte replacement. Ended the day with less than .5L of water and a small amount of the electrolyte replacement.

Mt Wilson downhill did a number on my knees too. Took about 3 weeks for them to recover. Came down way too fast for the grade.


Hey - that water is right where I said it would be! LOL Except I said two miles from the top. Same thing though. Glad you found it. Coming up on the other Idylwild side (Marion Mountain, Fuller, etc) there is a bit more waer. I am told that there is water on the PCT about a 1/2 mile from Wellmans, but since we aboarted our last hike early I didn't see it for myself..................................................DUG
Posted By: DUG Re: Quick trip to San Jacinto - 08/29/10 02:37 AM
So after having a "wardrobe malfunction" two weeks ago on San J's Deer Springs Trail, we came back this morning. It actually worked out pretty well because one of my Boy Scouts who was one 20 mile hike away from finishing his badge asked to tag along. I ran the numbers by Tom Harrison and it was, well, close enough. The 1/2 mile or so it was short was made up for by the 5300 feet of UP we did throughout the day in my book.

So me, Mike and our new sidekick headed up the trail at 0605. Since this scout has stayed away from the trails lately I was unsure how he would perform. I put him in the lead so we wouldn't go to fast, but that backfired when he nervously set a much too fast pace. After two miles I sent Mike to releive him on point. Mike set an easy pace and we soon hit the PCT.

We decided to do Deer Springs as a loop so we headed south on the PCT until it hit the Wellman Juction. From there it was the same ole same ole for me and Mike, but it was all new to our buddy. Mike kept the pace slow and we took about 6 hours to hit the summit. We weren't trying to beat any records, just trying to help a scout finish his badge and get the check in the block for the trail head.

On the way down we headed towards Fuller/Marion Mountain which is a much steeper trail. We hit the PCT again which dropped us back at Deer Springs. A quick 4.3 miles later we were at the truck. A little over ten hours.

Talked to a lot of great people throughout the day, including group headed to Whitney in two weeks. Answered all their questions as best as I could. I'm no pro with just 16 summits. LOL..................................DUG
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